Long ago, when the worlds were young and the godlings first explored and folded the dazzling facets of reality (i.e. 2022-2023), I had the pleasure of corresponding with Evergreen. At long last, I am delighted to share our conversation and their music with you.
CR:
I thought we would start talking about the dim and distant past, your secret musical origins: what was your relationship to music as a child? When did you fall in love with music? What did that fascination look like?
Evergreen:
When I was a kid, I was always drawn to music. My parents have always been big fans of music as well, so some of my earliest memories are of hearing music in the house. I developed some of my taste from what they liked for sure, but as I got older I really found myself seeking calmer music than what my parents liked—at least when I was really young. However I would say my musical taste and musical journey didn’t happen until I was a little bit older.
When I got into my early teens, I decided I wanted to play guitar which launched me even more in a musical direction. I began getting more into metal and industrial music, but I liked quite a wide variety of music at that time. I was always drawn to electronic music, however. In my early teens, I discovered several artists that really changed my life and how I viewed music as a whole: Aphex Twin, Boards of Canada, Brian Eno, and Coil.
I had this friend when I was younger who I would spend a lot of time with. At this time I was particularly into the band Nine Inch Nails and my friend’s mom was a huge Nine Inch Nails fan. I had mentioned to her that I really loved some of his instrumental works. I think I had discovered that Trent Reznor did a Quake soundtrack and I said something to her about it. She told me that she wanted to send me home with a couple CDs to check out, which ended up being Aphex Twin’s “Selected Ambient Works Vol. II” and Brian Eno and Harold Budd’s “Ambient 2: the Plateaux of Mirror”. These two in particular were absolutely life changing. Prior to this, I had a more typical view of music—I thought it was something done by a “band”, typically guitar, bass, drums, and vocals. The discovery that music could be atmospheric, instrumental, meditative, and pensive—this really astounded and fascinated me.
I used to spend a lot of time just trying to discover music and, especially after discovering these whole other worlds, I spent a lot of time digging through various electronic music on the internet. I delved deeper into ambient music and I remember feeling, as a teenager, that I had found this thing I had always been looking for. Discovering artists like Robert Rich, Steve Roach, and Boards of Canada just plummeted me into this whole new understanding and love for music. This aligned with the creation of music for me too. It made me realize that I could make music that was instrumental or atmospheric and there were people out there who might care about it. It was very formative for how I approach music even to this day.
CR:
Can you tell me about where you grew up? Not just the places, but maybe a short description of your internal geography as a young one?
Evergreen:
When I was a kid, I was really drawn into the world of Middle Earth, as cliché as it may be. Seeing the Lord of the Rings movies awakened something in me that is hard to explain. After that I sought out, and read, the Hobbit and Lord of the Rings. I think that was really my first exposure to fantasy.
Growing up, we did not have video games in my house. At the time, most other kids had video games and some part of me felt like I was missing out on something. But looking back I am thankful for this actually. I was kind of forced to focus on creativity and imagination in a way that follows me to this day. I used to spend a lot of time drawing and writing stories about various fantastical worlds I imagined. When I really look back on my childhood, honestly, I think I was really just an introspective and introverted kid. I had friends, but I spent a lot of time in my head, coming up with ideas and new creations and trying my hand at most creative projects I could get my hands on.
Being raised in Colorado, my family spent a decent amount of time in the mountains which is something that certainly still informs me to this day. I was always very fascinated by the natural world and never quite felt at home in the city.
CR:
Evergreen, can you talk about how stories impacted your early life? What role did they play the development of your creative self?
Evergreen:
I suppose I would say stories impacted my life in my youth quite a bit. But mostly the stories I came up with in my head. Like I mentioned, I didn’t play video games. I also didn’t spend a ton of time watching TV or movies. I often would spend time drawing and coming up with my own stories and ideas that I would get lost in. I would say this is something that is a constant to this day. I spend a lot of time in my own head, I think.
The exceptions to this are the aforementioned works, but for the most part it took me getting older to sort of fall back in love with fantasy works and other stories. The last few years I have read a lot more than ever before—which has been really refreshing and inspiring.
CR:
Nice to hear! This is a generalization of course, but many of the musicians I choose to reach out to, especially the dungeon synth based people, have similar tales to tell about their imaginative younger years. Especially the spending a lot of time in their own heads bit.
I go through waves of reading fantasy and science fiction myself. What kinds of things have you been reading in the past couple of years? What is it that is causing you to fall in love with them?
Evergreen:
I think you’re absolutely right about this connection with dungeon synth. Even the way Erang talks about his own music and connection to what he does—it is very rooted in nostalgia. But it’s not a nostalgia for a time period so much as it is this longing for dreaming and imagining other worlds—which is something we often do when we are younger and are told not to do as we age and are jaded by the world. Embracing this has been a really important thing for me, of course as an artist, but also as a human being. It is especially wild to me to create things that have a very vivid and fleshed out world in my head that other people connect to in their own ways. I love this about dungeon synth.
A few years ago, I read through the Broken Earth trilogy by NK Jemisin which was a wild ride. This absolutely amazed me and sort of made me realize the fantasy and science fiction genres, or the larger speculative fiction genre, really can encompass so much more than we give them credit for. I am certainly not opposed to more classic fantasy tropes or anything like that but I would have to say that series really sent me back into seeking out more. I am currently, at least at the time of writing this, reading through another book of hers.
Last year I did a re-read of the Lord of the Rings, which is always phenomenal. That is a book, along with the Earthsea series, which I could honestly return to time and time again and never tire of it. It is such a cliché at this point, it almost feels absurd to mention it. But I can’t deny its impact on me as a person. I followed this by going straight into the Wheel of Time books which I spent most of 2021 ravenously reading. Those books are awesome because they take some very familiar, very LotR-esque themes and expand on them, slowly filling out a world that is so rich with its own cultures and history… all in a very unique setting.
I’ve spent this year kind of reading a variety of things, from Redwall books to some of the Malazan Book of the Fallen series to some China Miéville most recently. I always have a stack of books at the ready for whatever mood I may find myself in by the time I complete the book I am on.
I think what really draws me to these genres is their ability to assist the reader with analyzing the world we live in, process complex feelings or thoughts, or just otherwise imagine other ways of existing. I think the way speculative fiction takes you out of the world in which we reside into another one can help process or understand things about ourselves or our world in ways that other fiction can’t always do. When you’re already suspending disbelief to imagine a world with dragons and wizards, for instance, the options can be nearly limitless. I guess it is on brand for me, but perhaps the best way to describe what I love about fantasy and science fiction is to quote Ursula K. Le Guin:
“For fantasy is true, of course. It isn’t factual, but it’s true. Children know that. Adults know it too and that’s precisely why many of them are afraid of fantasy. They know that its truth challenges, even threatens, all that is false, all that is phony, unnecessary, and trivial in the life they have let themselves be forced into living. They are afraid of dragons because they are afraid of freedom.”
CR:
Evergreen, you wrote about that feeling in a lovely way; it is most definitely one of the things that keeps me coming back to dungeon synth, I keep stumbling upon these little gems that seem to capture feelings I've always had and can't quite articulate into words. It is my favorite part of it all and it is transforming how I think of creative expression, which is amazing and inspiring.
I will do a deep dive back into Le Guin some day; I read her when I was a boy and since then I have watched her speeches and read essays of hers. She is magnificent and is on my long list of authors to continue to explore. I read Redwall a long time ago as well and loved it. Lord of the Rings I have read a few times and it is formative~ I have been a roleplayer my whole life and almost all of that is indebted to Tolkien. I haven't dug into the Wheel of Time books yet, but I have always wanted to.
NK Jemisin is most definitely in my stack of 'will someday read', and I'm excited to take that plunge. Malazan Book of the Fallen series is something that is constantly brought up around me and I can't imagine not giving that a go. China Miéville is one of my favorites~ I've read the New Crozubon books and some of his other works.
My main impediment in finishing books is my obsession with Gene Wolfe and John Crowley. They are both dense writers. The Wolfe stuff I have taken to reading in tandem with podcasts that analyze the chapters, so they take me forever~ which is great, but has slowed my consumption of writing to a crawl the past couple of years. I don't know if you've read either of these authors, but they are well worth the time. They create beautiful and nuanced narratives.
When did you start making music of your own? What compelled you to go beyond listening to music to crafting it yourself? What did that early music look like for you?
Evergreen:
Oh yes I obviously have to highly recommend Ursula K. Le Guin’s work. A deep dive would be a good way to go. Her scifi is quite amazing. I particularly love the Left Hand of Darkness and The Dispossessed. Powerful books, for sure.
I have heard great things about the Book of the New Sun. One day I will get around to it. I have so many things on the list as it is! Haha.
When I was young, I wanted to get into music so I asked my parents for a guitar. My mom got me a guitar with the caveat that I needed to take lessons for it. So I took lessons for quite some time. I played in various bands as a teen, nothing super serious. I would say my real plunge into music was much more solitary. Like I mentioned, I had gotten really fascinated with electronic music and the sort of DIY ethic of it. It was endlessly fascinating to me that music could actually just be something that one person does without a band or a studio or any of that. So I spent a lot of time messing around with my own music on the computer.
My earlier music was often sample based, utilizing samples I would find. It was quite rudimentary and I was actually using really primitive software to make a lot of it. None of it was very good and almost all of it never ended up going anywhere. But I had a good time making it. I would work on it, oftentimes, really late at night.
My family took note of me doing this and eventually bought me a synth and a drum machine. I, oddly enough, use both of these regularly to this day. I worked on a bit more stuff using my synth, some of which I ended up actually sharing with friends. I had tried my hand at some ambient music, as my fascination with ambient had grown tremendously at that time.
I eventually created my project Evergreen Refuge, when I was 18 or so, which ended up being a primary focus for me for several years. It, however, was typically more guitar focused. But I’ve always kind of worked on lots of different things, and throughout working on Evergreen Refuge material I was always working on electronic and ambient music.
CR:
So, can you walk me through the evolution of your different projects? I'd like to give readers an idea of the worlds you have created and work within.
Evergreen:
Yes, so like I said, Evergreen Refuge was my first major project outside of the casual ambient and electronic music I was making as a teen. I spent years mostly focusing on Evergreen Refuge and it was part of a lot of deeply meaningful personal stuff for me. In a lot of ways it represents a lot of my personal and spiritual growth from the last ten years or so. Throughout working on this, I had a few projects that I worked on off and on, Tunica Externa and Oneiromancer being the main ones. These were mostly focused on live settings and were both more in the drone and noise worlds. I started working on them a lot when I moved back to the city and was sort of figuring out how to exist in this world.
In early 2019 I was in a really rough place, personally. A variety of things came to a head in my life and I was struggling with my mental health quite a bit. This is when a lot of changes seems to happen in my life. This is when I created Fogweaver, which was largely a way to channel some of those emotions and find a bit of escape and solace. I made the first album expecting nobody to hear it or care about it at all, but it was a really special recording for me. At the end of 2019 I put Evergreen Refuge on an indefinite hiatus. I am still unsure if I ever plan on returning to it.
Since then, I have worked on a lot of various dungeon synth and ambient related work. Hideous Gomphidius, Keys to Oneiria, Snowspire, Draconic Regicide, Delmak-O, are just a few examples. I could probably go into depth about each one, but this would end up being quite a lengthy answer to a simple question haha!
CR:
I would love to go in depth on each of these, if you are up for it! Before we do so, I was hoping that you could explain how you make your music. What is your general creative process? What do you use to make your sounds? I realize that this might be different for each of your projects. Also, you mention your mental health and finding escape and solace in your creativity; when you are creating your music is part of what you do intended to provide some of this for other people?
Evergreen:
Oh yes, sure! My creative process does vary between projects, but mostly in terms of headspace and gear. Overall, I am very tactile person. I really like using hardware and pedals for what I do. My brain does not seem to like computers and piano roll methods as much. But yeah, some projects vary a bit as far as this goes. Sometimes I sit down and record layer after layer, slowly composing as I go. But sometimes I like to limit myself to pure minimalism and live and/or improvisational recording. I suppose I can go into this a bit with the breakdown of each project. As for your latter question, I do think a fair amount of what I do is intended to provide some solace for people. Sometimes I make things that are intentionally sad or angry, but even in those I think the intention is catharsis (mostly for me, but there is always some amount of intention there for the listener as well). We live in a world with horrors everywhere, with sadness and hardship constantly around us. I suppose I would like to make music that provides some amount of solace to people.
Now for an extensive breakdown of projects--get ready, there is a lot:
Fogweaver is one of the "main" projects. I don't really like to think of anything as a "main" or "side" project per se. They are all special and important to me in some way. That said, Fogweaver is one I return to frequently. It is based entirely on the Earthsea books by Ursula K. Le Guin. I kind of began this project because I thought, there are a lot of Tolkien dungeon synth projects out there, I would like to do something based on my favorite books. These books are very special to me and creating an atmosphere for how they make me feel has been something that has been really healing to me and, of course, a humbling and fun experience. Like I mentioned, I mostly use an array of synths and keyboards with Fogweaver. I try to opt for a balance between minimalism and almost an "epic" sort of dungeon synth feel. I am particularly drawn to old nostalgic sounds of Casios and Yamaha keyboards. There is something about them that feels timeless and grainy in a way that really captures the feeling the Earthsea books give me.
Snowspire is my winter synth project. Snowspire began somewhat as a dungeon synth project based on winter and has since become something that I channel a very spontaneous winter feeling energy into. The last several albums for this project have been composed entirely spontaneously and often in one take. My approach here is that I wait for that feeling I get every time winter approaches, when my bones start to feel that cold and my mind starts to get that sort of somber feeling. Once I get this, I sit down with one synth and a lot of reverb and I just create. Something about this approach captures something really special to me. It almost freezes (pardon the pun) a moment in time and captures that feeling of winter in a way I can't really explain.
Hideous Gomphidius is one of my stranger projects. I have a sort of story and world that I have created in my head for Hideous Gomphidius, but I actually like to leave this somewhat open to interpretation. The bulk of the idea is relatively obvious though: this is based on a world in which there are malicious mushroom monsters and fungal sorcerers which you may only find if you stumble into the most remote places. I like to sort of find the balance between whimsy and darkness, something that I feel embodies fungi as a whole. Fungi are strange and I have a long-standing fascination with them. There are some that are delicious, there are some that will kill you, and there are some that send you to other planes. Overall, Hideous Gomphidius is where I channel some strange feelings and more experimental approaches. I like to incorporate other elements like noise, doom, and even electronic music into this project.
Keys to Oneiria is one of my more old school and minimalist dungeon synth projects. With Keys to Oneiria, my inspiration is similar to Hideous Gomphidius in that I have a sort of deep world that the inspiration comes from, but I like to leave it open to the listener to interpret as they may. The vast majority is based on the world of dreams, Oneiria. I envision this project as a portal to this world and a sort of magical fantasy world of my own creation. I was, and am constantly, inspired by Secret Stairways for this project. My approach here is pretty simple most of the time. I like to limit myself to synths and pedals and I record entirely using a cassette four-track. For me, the imperfection and the tape hiss is all part of the atmosphere.
Delmak-O is my more sci-fi inspired synthesizer project. This is one I like to leave pretty open ended. You will notice some projects of mine are very focused on one specific thing (ie dungeon synth based on the Earthsea books that sounds "this" way). Delmak-O is one I want to keep largely vague, but broadly encompasses the more science fiction inspirations I have. The last two albums have been based on stories set in a world of my creation, and have served as soundtracks to stories I wrote. This is an approach I plan to take with some of my future material with the project as well. I have always loved writing and coming up with stories, so this is my outlet for that in a sci-fi sense anyhow. I like to use an array of synthesizers, making very "synth-forward" music. I have a lot of plans for future material, I just need the time to work on it haha!
Draconic Regicide, similar to Delmak-O, is very narrative driven. It began as something that felt more like a "one-off" project. I had this idea of a story and really just created the first album as a soundtrack to that story. I did not really have an intention to return to the project, but earlier this year I was overcome with inspiration for a story set in the same world, which is where "Shadowrealm" came from. This project has sort of developed into being about writings set in one specific fantasy world that I have come up with. I have no idea if I will make more, but I left things pretty open ended in case I have inspiration in the future. My approach, musically, is to make music kind of in that world between dark ambient and epic dungeon synth. Again, its intention is largely to be a soundtrack to the stories.
Woodland Spells is another more lofi dungeon synth project that focuses on magical woodlands (of course). The intention has been largely to make music that is extremely minimalist, opting for one synth and very simple compositions, all embodying the feeling that nature gives me. Thus, of course, I typically record using one keyboard and a few pedals, and I record it all pretty live and spontaneously. Similar to what I mentioned about Snowspire, I like to take an approach that really captures a very specific feeling and time. This is actually the same approach for many of my projects under the Windkey banner, albeit in different ways. So that said, I will go through them more quickly here. Dusklight is meant to capture a sort of dreamy and meditative feeling, based largely on the sun and the seasons. Wandlimb is very focused on ents and foresty magic in an even more naive way. It is supposed to be almost like the music that a child, or a young ent, would dream up. Largely idyllic and peaceful, I record using a keyboard and a very bad cassette recorder that makes it sound really warbly and noisy, which is all part of the atmosphere. Sylvan Specter is where I channel more of the somber and depressive feelings I have, capturing them with a similar old-school and lofi dungeon synth approach.
Evergreen Refuge, as I mentioned before, was a project of mine outside of the dungeon and other synth worlds. It was meant to be an embodiment of my own spiritual kind of ideas and nature worship. It was very guitar forward, in the worlds of dark folk, black metal and ambient music. I am not sure if I plan to return to this project or not, to be honest. I put it on hiatus in 2019 and have had no intention of returning just yet. But every time I think about ending it for good, I hesitate. It represents a huge part of me and really shows where I have been and how I have changed over the years. It is very special to me in so many ways.
I have some other projects and bands that I won't go into as much. But this is already quite the lengthy list as is, haha!
Editor’s note~ Evergreen is also a member of this amazing project:
CR:
This is lovely. I am pretty tactile myself. I am interested to hear what you have to say about the relationship between the LGBTQIA+ and the greater dungeon synth and adjacent communities.
Evergreen:
I have a fair amount of feelings on the subject but I can only really speak to this from more of a personal perspective, so bear in mind that this is where my feelings on the matter come from. I also talked semi-recently with several dear friends, Jenn Taiga and Kelsey of Erreth-Akbe, on this subject and we all expressed some similar thoughts on this subject.
First and foremost, I think with dungeon synth being largely, at this point in time, an internet genre, people are a little more able to meet like-minded folks. Dungeon synth is already a niche within a niche within a niche and with the addition of the internet, I think connecting with people within even smaller circles is really easy to do. And, largely because of this, I have met quite a fair number of queer people within dungeon synth. And, like I said, I think by virtue of it already being kind of a niche and strange genre/community, seeing more queerness within it is not all that surprising to me personally. You will often see a lot of queer people within really niche and "strange" or "outsider" kinds of things, for a number of reasons that I won't go into fully here. Being within dungeon synth, I feel my identity is often more validated than it tends to be in my day-to-day life. Don't get me wrong, dungeon synth as a community has plenty of opportunity for improvement and I have certainly been subjected to some less favorable opinions and thoughts on the matter from other people. But I do think that by virtue of a lot of the community and genre already being into "nerdy" stuff, people tend to be more open minded in my experience.
Another thing dungeon synth in particular has going for it in this regard is the anonymity of it all. It is relatively easy to forge an entirely separate and anonymous identity for the sake of a dungeon synth project. Within this, I think there is some amount of liberation. You can more or less be who you want to be or who you see yourself as. I have seen, a number of times, this anonymity ends up being a gateway for people to open up better about who they actually are. It is a really beautiful thing. I know I can speak to this from personal experience a bit. Connecting with people over the last 10+ years through music, I have been able to allow myself to be who I am more and more through the light anonymity I have embraced. I have learned a lot about who I am and I have been able to sort of shed some of the expectations of who I am "supposed to be" because people just generally know me through the music I create. I am not sure if this entirely makes sense, it is hard to completely articulate it all.
Also, speaking in a very personal manner, a fair amount of who I am and what tends to guide a lot of my feelings is the sense of feeling like an outsider everywhere--a deep amount of imposter syndrome has been a constant struggle in my own life. Again, this can all be difficult to fully articulate, but being a nonbinary and queer person I have always felt disconnected from binary ways of being in general. I never felt comfortable with being socialized into masculinity. I never felt comfortable embracing binary sexuality. I have always felt "outside" or perhaps "between" in a lot of ways. I have just generally always loved liminal spaces and ambiguity... there is great comfort in the undefinable for me. For this reason, I think I can say with certainty that this is one reason why I particularly love dungeon synth. In my opinion, dungeon synth is a genre predicated upon imposter syndrome. It is related to black metal, to be sure. But it is not black metal. It is related to dark ambient, but it is not necessarily dark ambient. There are elements of RPG soundtracks and video game music, but it is also not those things. The efforts at neatly defining the genre are complicated in my opinion, and I personally like it that way. In a world where we constantly define everything and place things in, often binary, categories, I find a lot of comfort in this community that has many entry points and many inspirations and many origins. It is a beautiful thing to me. When discussing this with friends of mine, we expressed some similar sentiments on this exact subject.
CR:
This answers a lot of the questions and eloquently articulates ideas I have had in relation to dungeon synth. Thank you for that. I think that most people, at least those of reflective bent, can empathize with the idea of existing in liminal spaces. Some more so than others, perhaps. Thinking about genre definitions, I think everything I have ever done creatively exists in these spaces. I think that art that stays true to itself tends to defy comfortable categorization. It may be that lives that stay true to themselves share that quality.
I am interested in how place manifests itself as a co-creator in art. I know you are drawn to and are inspired by the world. Are there particular places which resonate in your heart? How do they influence your creative process?
Evergreen:
Yes indeed! Nature is a huge inspiration all the time for me. Basically for as long as I can remember, it was always something that fascinated me more than anything else. Some of my earliest and fondest childhood memories are from going to the mountains with my family, breathing the mountain air and feeling that serenity that can only really come from the natural world. If you look at most of my work, it tends to come back to being rooted at least somewhat in the natural world. Even a lot of my connection to the Earthsea books is rooted in the way that LeGuin's worldbuilding is very much on nature and balance. The dragons in Earthsea, for instance, represent wildness and freedom. The magic is all about balance and is very much based within Taoism.
My connection to the natural world goes beyond merely that I think nature is beautiful. Different projects of mine delve into different ideas I have about the natural world--different feelings I get from it, and different feelings I get from different places. I am often inspired by different locations or even different times of year. The seasons play an important role in what I am inspired by at any given time. My project Evergreen Refuge was a deep foray into a deeper connection with the natural world and my place within it. I believe you may be referring to something I recently shared which was that a keystone work in the Evergreen Refuge catalogue recently turned 10 years old, which has a lot of meaning to me that I won't delve in too much here. Suffice to say, it is weird watching these works age, especially when the inspiration and headspace I was in at the time of recording is so deeply rooted and personal.
But yes, to answer your question, it is funny that we were just talking about liminality. The place which I currently reside could be seen as somewhat of a liminal space--an "ecotone" as they call it--a transitional place between two different ecosystems. In my case I am saddled between the desert and the alpine ecosystems in the southwest US. It is a strange kind of "high desert" where you have lots of juniper and sagebrush and if you increase ever so slightly in elevation, you start to see more alpine ponderosa trees. This is the most comfortable kind of place for me in a lot of ways. I enjoy being able to be in beautiful mountain valleys and desert canyons in the same amount of time. So in that way, I am actually inspired by a lot of different landscapes. This kind of place has always felt like "home" to me, which is an amorphous and ambiguous kind of idea, but it has been on my mind a fair amount since returning from Northeast Dungeon Siege. Sometimes leaving home makes you realize how much you take for granted--how much you truly feel rooted in a place. I suppose I should have learned this from my multiple reads of the Hobbit and Lord of the Rings! Haha!
CR:
I usually close by asking about people you would suggest readers check out. However, I think you've been doing this consistently in your Instagram account since the turn of the year. Maybe I'll put more of a direct twist on the question-
Who are people you think are deserving of more attention in the community?
Evergreen:
There are so many amazing people in the community and it is so hard to just pick a few haha! Some artists that I think deserve some more attention in the community are, in no specific order:
Willow Tea (and various projects from the artist such as Woods of Sith Cala, Nebelkrähe, Gnornian and so many more). They do amazing work and are just a wonderful human being. Another is my dear friend from the projects Mausoleum Wanderer and Faerie Cross Grotto. Also just an amazing human being with an awesome body of work and knack for incredibly unique music. Next I will say my friend Jenn Taiga who is another dear friend and a force of true synth sorcery. She has a wildly unique and powerful take on dungeon synth. To limit this to just four, because I could go on and on, I’ll mention my friend Joe who does the projects Forgotten Relic and Hidden Passage, along with several other. He is a great person and he’s making some truly special stuff.
Like I said, there are truly so many amazing people in the community and I look forward to all of your interviews! Thank you for doing it. I really appreciate you taking the time to do this, both for me and for the community. It has been great talking with you.
CR:
Thank you so much, for all your time and your genuine engagement with the questions. I think you're amazing, Evergreen.
Thanks to Evergreen for displaying the patience of an Ent.
I’m looking forward to sharing more interviews, hopefully this week.
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Thank you for reading.